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Episode
Kate Grandbois: Hello, everyone. Welcome to SLP Nerdcast. We're very excited to welcome two new guests to the show to discuss developmental language disorder.
Welcome Paula Orrego and Carla McGregor.
Karla K. McGregor: Thank you.
Paula Orrego: Hi. Thank you.
Amy Wonkka: Paula and Carla, you are both here to discuss developing with developmental language disorder. But before we get started, could you please tell us a little bit about yourselves?
Paula Orrego: Well, um, hi, I'm Paula. I am a clinical fellow speech language pathologist working at an inpatient rehabilitation hospital with adults.
Um, I, uh, earned my Bachelor of Science in Psychology and Social Action at Pomona University, then went to the University of Washington's post-baccalaureate program in Speech and Hearing Sciences, and then I went to Emerson College for my Master of Science. Um, outside of my job, [00:03:00] I continue my work helping people as an anti-bullying activist and a disability justice advocate, as well as a motivational speaker, and I've been a social justice and political activist and public speaker for the past 15 years, if you can believe it.
And now I can say I'm a children's book author because my picture book, The Little Pig, just got published.
Karla K. McGregor: Yay.
Paula Orrego: Hooray. And I also identify as a deal deer
Karla K. McGregor: Fantastic. And I'm Karla, Karla McGregor. I work at Boys Town National Research Hospital, where I'm a research scientist. I'm also by training a clinical SLP, and I've been at this a really long time.
I've been studying developmental language disorder for over 30 years, and in fact, Paula and I met, um, and co-authored a paper together that was published in '23 about her experiences living with DLD, and, um, I was, um, honored to do that with you, [00:04:00] Paula, because it gave me a chance to take my sort of nerdy obsessions with the science and the literature and I think bring them alive a little bit for our readers because of the experiences you were brave enough and generous enough to share.
So it's good to be here.
Paula Orrego: Oh, it's so kind of you to say. Thank you. There's, there's so much love already. This is gonna be such a good one.
Kate Grandbois: I'm, I'm so excited. Um- It's gonna be fun ... we're very excited to welcome you both. Um, for anybody who's listening who is maybe familiar with the show or not familiar with the show, we love bringing together, uh, lived experience, the power of lived experience, the power of perspective, centering the voices of those who we serve, with some nerdy science.
So this is a really wonderful blend- ... of two things that we love to do. Before we get into all of the wisdom that you all are gonna share with us today, we do need to review our, some housekeeping things, um, and read our [00:05:00] learning objectives, so I will try to get through that as quickly as possible.
Learning objective number one: recognize the signs of possible DLD in children and adults. Learning objective number two: understand the impact DLD can have on a person's family, social life, academics, and mental health. And learning ob- learning outcome number three: understand how to best support a person with DLD academically, emotionally, and in the workplace.
For anyone listening who would like to learn more about the financial and non-financial disclosures of both the hosts and the guests of today's episode, all of that information is listed in the show notes, as well as on the landing page of our website and this episode. Additionally, if you are using this course for ASHA CEUs, you will find the link to the post-test in the show notes as well as on the website landing page.
Okay, I'm done. All the boring stuff is over, and now we get to- Woo ... talk about the fun stuff.
Amy Wonkka: All right. All right. I'm looking forward to it. Um, Paula and Karla, [00:06:00] before we get into, into your story, um, and into the various learning objectives, can you start us off by just telling us a little bit, give us a quick overview of DLD?
Karla K. McGregor: Sure, absolutely. I can-- I'll take that one. Um, so I assume that most of your listeners are speech-language pathologists, and so, um, this general space will be familiar for them. So when we, uh, talk about developmental language disorder, we're talking about people who, um, uh, often are diagnosed as children, but the problem does persist into adulthood.
We're talking about children who might, when they're in, um, school, might qualify for special education under categories like speech and language impairment or perhaps specific learning disabilities because developmental language disorder is a condition whereby, uh, learning and using and understanding spoken and written language is, is difficult, more [00:07:00] difficult than it is for their peers, um, their same-age peers.
So obviously, with the importance of language in everything we do, right? Learning, making friends, um, making sense of what you're gonna do with your day, right? You even write things to yourself, right? So with the importance of language in everything we do, developmental language disorder is certainly not something to be ignored.
Um, people don't grow out of it, and, uh, one, one reason that Paula's story is such a gift is because she is now an adult, and she can reflect on both what it's like to be a child with DLD but also what it's like to still have DLD when you are grown up. So I, I think that's really important to realize. Um, maybe the only other thing to say for now is that, um, developmental language disorder is really highly prevalent.
So we think about ADHD and dyslexia as being really common, and it's equally common. Um, and in fact, a lot of people who have [00:08:00] DLD will also have ADHD or might also have dyslexia. So, um, sometimes these things ride along together. Um, for the SLP, that can make diagnosis difficult because, ooh, which is it, or is it both?
Um, but, you know, so go the complexities of being a human, right? Um, it's not an easy diagnosis to make in all cases, but it's such an important one. Um, without the diagnosis, you can't get the services, right? So yeah, I think that's kind of why we're here, is to help people recognize what DLD is all about and, and maybe what we can do about it as SLPs.
Kate Grandbois: I, I really appreciate you framing, you know, some of the background and, you know, EBP-related nerdy, uh, as I mentioned, the nerdy information first. Mm. Um, before we jump into your story, Paula, I wonder if this is a good opportunity [00:09:00] to unpack, um, disability and context, right? And I know this is not an episode about models of disability.
Um, however, I think that there are some likely important foundational pieces related to seeing disability as context- Mm-hmm ... um, that might be really helpful to review before we start talking about the, the, the richness that is the context of life, right? And li- and lived experience. Mm-hmm. Karla, do you wanna walk us through some of that?
Or Paula, do you wanna work- walk us through some of that as well?
Karla K. McGregor: You know, yeah, I can start, but I, I think, I think Paula's story has a lot to do with the context she found herself in over time. So I know you're gonna wanna add to this, Paula, but, um, i- in my lab w- w- we've been finding it super useful to make a distinction between impairment and disability.
And so we think about the [00:10:00] impairment, the language impairment in this case, as some developmental difference in how the brain is developing and thus how it functions, in this case how it functions to learn and process language. Um, and that's part of the individual, right? That's part of who that individual is.
But we think about disability much more as involving not just the individual, but the world around the individual, and that's where the context comes in, right? So a pers- you could take two people with, uh, you know, rather similar severities of a language impairment, and arguably one might be disabled and one might not be disabled at all.
And I think that really speaks to the context around that person. What are the new developmental challenges they're facing? What are the supports they have in, in, um, in their lives? Uh, what are the other challenges they have in their lives? Um, challenges of the family or challenges at school, right? So those kinds of things can, can make the impairment loom [00:11:00] large.
And then when you're in a very supportive environment, um, might function very well and really don't show lots of signs of disability. And I think what happens often is that waxes and wanes. Um, so at one moment of life the child is functioning really well, but a few years later maybe not as well, and that can go back and forth.
So I don't know if you wanna share any particular experiences about that, Paula?
Paula Orrego: Oh, definitely. I mean, I think you just summed up my life in that way of like, it, it does, it does come- It, it's like a, it is like a, if you were to picture, uh, bell curves and, uh, or hills and valleys, that up and down of how I was functioning in my life.
It, it definitely waxes and wanes, as you s- as you found in your research. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And I'll be pu- I'll be touching upon that when I, when I talk about my story. Yeah.
Karla K. McGregor: Maybe you do wanna talk about your story now.
Paula Orrego: All right.
Karla K. McGregor: I don't think people want me to just yammer on and [00:12:00] on and on about- Yeah, please do
Kate Grandbois: the
Karla K. McGregor: communication tech stuff I would love to
Paula Orrego: hear it. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Um, well, so I guess to give you a brief rundown of the timeline, we'll start at age two So at that time, I mostly spoke at the one-word level in both English and Spanish. Um, the prevailing thought at that time was that bilingual children always started out presenting as if with a language delay, right?
But eventually, they, they're gonna catch up with their peers eventually. Um, when I was four years old, my preschool teacher's aide expressed to my parents her concern about my language skills, right, and recommended an eval, um, which of course I qualified for speech and language therapy. This was not something that was going to go away.
Um, and I started receiving school speech therapy in kindergarten. Um, but these services were only in [00:13:00] English. The, the bi- the SLP was not bilingual in Spanish. Um, she recommended that I look outside of school for more comprehensive bilingual testing, and then that's how I began services with Stella, my private bilingual SLP, who was also the third ar- uh, article author of
Yeah, I was able to ... We have a, we have a strong, uh, connection, Stella and my family. Uh, we've kept contact all these years and after all this time. I love that. I love
Kate Grandbois: this so much.
Paula Orrego: Yeah, yeah.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm,
Paula Orrego: mm-hmm.
Karla K. McGregor: You know, that's one thing that made this opportunity so special is that, um, I, I assume it might be fairly rare for a grown-up to have stayed in contact with their childhood SLP, but Paula and her mother had stayed in contact with Stella, who's the SLP, and that's part of the bi- uh, a main part of the reason why Paula knows so much about her early
Like, people don't remember what their speech language [00:14:00] was like at two, right? But, but, you know, but Stella remembers, and so that's why we know some of the early history that Paula, uh, Paula's early history of speech language development. Yeah.
Paula Orrego: And she was so gracious to be part of this article with us, and she wrote in that article, um, what her, not just what her experience was like for me, but kind of also giving advice to other SLPs and like, "This is, these are the things that I did with Paula, and they seemed to work."
Um, but yeah, so, um, uh, Stella quickly noticed, quickly noticed that I had a nervous temperament, um, as did my kindergarten teacher actually. And Stella recommended at that time that I see a neuropsychologist, who then diagnosed me with anxiety at age five. Um, at the end of that kindergarten year, instead of continuing on the bilingual school path, I actually repeated kindergarten, but in the English-only [00:15:00] program.
And one of the reasons for that was because English, surprisingly, was my preferred language, even though I learned Spanish first. Um, and the thought was that if I was in an environment where I spoke only my preferred language, then perhaps the anxiety would lessen a little bit. I think English was my preferred language because that was the language that I was surrounded by living in California in the United States, um, even though I s- spoke Spanish at home.
Um, so Also, the SLPs at the time were taught that exposing a child to another language could make DLD worse. Um, I'm, I'm glad to hear that we know now that bilingualism or multilingualism in general doesn't cause or worsen DLD. So, yeah. I, uh, at seven years old then, I graduated from school therapy. And [00:16:00] I say graduated with quotation marks 'cause-
Um, my, my parents and Stella knew I was still severe. Um, I was diagnosed with moderate to severe, um, w- now what we call DLD. It wasn't called DLD at the time. Um, but I needed to continue speech and language therapy. Yeah.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. And then you were out of therapy in the school system for, like, three, four years, right?
Was it, like, third grade to sixth grade you were out?
Paula Orrego: Yeah, and I, well, I never went back to school s- uh, school speech therapy. Um-
Karla K. McGregor: Oh, well, I'm thinking about, you did get a, a- eventually you were dismissed from Stella's caseload too, though. Yes. So there was a gap, right? There was a gap where things were going pretty well.
Paula Orrego: Yes.
Karla K. McGregor: Right? Yes. But, yeah. Yeah.
Paula Orrego: Yeah. And at that time, when I ... So I was eight years old. Um- Mm-hmm ... or no, I was nine years old, [00:17:00] and I had reached age-appropriate language levels, and now I had actually earned the graduation from speech and language therapy, right? Mm-hmm. I wasn't just dismissed because the SLP at the school had a really large caseload.
But - Um, yeah. And then, um, uh, but at age eight, I, I switched out of that bilingual school, and I went to second grade in a new English-only public school. And then fast-forward a few years. At 11 years old, I applied to three private college prep schools that, of course, did not have, uh, SLP services. Um, and I didn't disclose my disability because at that time, and I s- I say at that time like I'm, like I'm an old lady, but it was
Kate Grandbois: only- Hey, the world has changed a lot in the last couple of years.
It has. I, I, I think that you are justified in whatever timeline you would like to present. [00:18:00]
Paula Orrego: That's right. It's just- That's right ... it's wild to me because it was the, it was the mid-2000s, and- This disability was something that nobody talked about. I remember one school we, my parents and I went to their open house, and one of the presenters there, before he s- said the hello and the welcomes, he said, "If your child has a problem with reading or math, do not apply to our school.
Please leave now." That was the culture- Oh my ... in the mid-2000s. Right. So, like, how was I ever going to be like, "Hello, I have
Kate Grandbois: DLD." For anybody who's listening and not watching, Amy and our faces are ...
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah.
Kate Grandbois: That is, I mean- Yeah ... the, the culture- Yeah ... of, of, um, you know, the institutions that we work in, that we learn in- Right
I mean- Right ... I'd like to think that we have changed significantly since then. Yes. That being said, [00:19:00] I'm willing to hold space for the fact that we have a lot of, a lot of work- Yes ... to do in a lot of ways as well. Right. Um, but I, I appreciate the, you know, reflection of what this con- Mm-hmm ... again, going back to this idea of context and disability, what this context- Mm-hmm
reflected back to you- Mm-hmm ... as a, as a human, as a human being, right?
Karla K. McGregor: Uh-huh. Right. Right. It really discouraged any disclosure. Of course, I mean, Paula's still really young at this point, but, but her mom's sitting there too, right? I'm sure it discouraged your mom as well. And you kind of add that to the fact that you had been doing pretty well, and you'd been dismissed from your formal therapies, right?
Mm-hmm. And so I, I think that is a great example of context. And, and sort of not surprisingly, the, the next part of the story is that school context became very difficult for you, and very disabling, right? And so that's kind of what we mean when we say the impairment's sort of always there, but whether it's disabling or not is a lot of other external [00:20:00] factors as well, right?
Mm-hmm. I don't know if it... Is it too painful to talk about the context at that school, and where your disabilities kind of emerged again?
Paula Orrego: No, no, I'm, I'd, I'd be happy to talk about it. That's part of what I do as a motivational speaker- Yeah ... and a, a- Yeah ... yeah, part of my activism is, is, yeah, talking about this.
Um, so the school that, uh, Carla's talking about, I got accepted into three schools, by the way, with scholarships. I'm not saying that to, like, brag. But, thanks, Kate. But, but I'm saying, like, even with a disability, I- Mm-hmm ... that I did not disclose, like, I, I still, I, I have to kind of, um, I, I have to kind of pat younger Paula on the back and be like, "You, you did this."
Right?
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah.
Paula Orrego: Um, and the, so the school is, uh, I chose an all-girls school that was, like, the, the top school that I wanted. Um, and I started sixth grade there. And that, yeah, that's where the new set of problems began. Mm-hmm. It was, like- [00:21:00] I- instead of having very direct math problems like multiply 12 by 4, now translate English into math, right?
Um, now instead of just free participation in class, I was being graded on how often I was participating and how well thought out I was in discussions. Um, my sixth grade science teacher started out parent-teacher conferences asking my parents if I had a hearing problem. Um, my math teacher accused me of cheating because I was crying during tests, but somehow was getting A's on my homework, which was bold of her to assume that I wasn't crying at home with the homework.
Kate Grandbois: Oh, my word. Right.
Paula Orrego: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then on top of all of that- Yeah ... I was being bullied by my peers and eventually my teachers too, because teachers can be bullies.
Karla K. McGregor: Oh, yeah.
Kate Grandbois: Yeah. I want to reach back in time and give you, give your sixth grade [00:22:00] self a big fat hug.
Karla K. McGregor: I know. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Young
Kate Grandbois: Paula. Thank
Paula Orrego: you.
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah. She
Paula Orrego: would've appreciated that, yeah.
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah. You know, I kind of want to jump in and, and say something about the homework. So I think one of our learning goals are, you know, what are signs that people might be seeing, um, if they suspect a child has DLD in the classroom setting. And I hear so many families, uh, so many families talk to me about homework for their children who have DLD because it can be such a, such a family stressor.
Um, the reason your homework was coming back and graded with A's is because you spent such a long time on your homework every night, right? And Paula's mom is a teacher, um, so Paula's mom was super supportive, and it wasn't that Paula's mom was doing her homework for her, but it's that, that that was a priority for the family that one does their homework, right?
[00:23:00] Yes. And it was a priority for Paula, and just the hours spent. So the hours, the tears, the arguments, the stress- Yeah ... um, I think is often a sign. You know, if the child is coming back with homework that's well done, but the stories are that took a lot of out of the kid to be able to do that, I think that's something to pay attention to.
Because it's, DLD often involves, uh, the need for extra processing time. And so if you have to read your homework instructions and then write the answers, those are language processing tasks, right? Mm-hmm. And it's gonna take a longer time for most children with DLD to do their homework than children with typical language development.
And I think that that was a real burden for you.
Paula Orrego: That was, and I re- I remember there was w- there was one weekend And I think it was actually more than just one w-weekend that this has happened where I spend, I kid you not, I, because I counted twelve hours [00:24:00] doing all of my homework and that was in middle school
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah,
Paula Orrego: yeah.
Karla K. McGregor: Ugh.
Amy Wonkka: What, and, and also when you're spending 12 hours doing your homework, young Paula's also getting no time for rest or relaxation or fun or- Right,
Paula Orrego: no ...
Amy Wonkka: that's, do you r- do you recall that time as being r- a really highly stressful time in your life? Oof.
Paula Orrego: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I mean, that's, that's part of the trauma, right?
I, and I w- I was in, um, uh, I was in karate, and you can see there I have my, my belts. Yippee. But, you know, the... But, um, I was in karate and I was also teaching karate once a week to the little kids, and y- I remember my sensei at one point, he's like, "You're not even here anymore, Paula." And it's like, you don't even under- you don't even know.
You don't understand. Like, it, it's not that I don't wanna be [00:25:00] here, but I'm spending, you know, b- and I didn't, I didn't realize that for the neurotypical child, what takes them maybe like three hours of homework takes me double time, um, until I was 14 and I got re-diagnosed, um, by the neuropsychologist and then, um, I can go into that story real quick when- whatever
Amy Wonkka: That, no, that would be great.
I would love for you to walk us through that process if you're open to it. Yeah. And just tell us a little bit about it and-
Paula Orrego: Oh, yeah ...
Amy Wonkka: and what, what happened from there.
Paula Orrego: Yeah, so I was 14, and I, I had a history final that I failed miserably because I didn't finish it. It had multiple choice questions, fill in the blank questions, short answers, and an essay.
And I think we had to finish it within, like, an hour, an hour and a half. And my parents and I realized, yeah, I, I was [00:26:00] 18, right? Or excuse me, I was eighth grade.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm.
Paula Orrego: It's only going to get worse from here if I don't get some kind of support. So I got re-diagnosed with DLD, and the school received a list of recommended accommodations, which they mostly abided by.
Um, the uh, the accommodations that I was allowed in, and continuing on to college and grad school, though I didn't necessarily need to use all of them during grad school, and I can, I can explain that in a little bit why, um, were, uh, double time on tests, so I had more time to process the questions and think carefully through my answers.
Uh, guaranteed seating at the front. Uh, receiving all my slides before class, so I didn't have to worry about listening to my teacher or my professor and writing down everything from the board. Um- A separate room to take my tests and extra [00:27:00] time on my assignments, although that wasn't, that was not guaranteed and that was not, that was certainly did not, that was not in my, uh, in my high school accommodations.
That started in college, yeah. Um, but-
Kate Grandbois: So di- I'm sorry to, to interrupt No ... I just have a question. I'm thinking of the experience of, you know, being still a developing brain, right? A middle schooler, where you're... I mean, my, I have two teenagers now and I have, one of them is a middle schooler, and the feelings, man.
I mean, there's a lot of feelings in, in middle school. Mm-hmm. Um, diagnoses aside, when some of these accommodations were given and you had this, the slides ahead of time or you had the, the, you know, the double time for a test, did you feel that you, your anxiety improved or that you were able to, you know, take a deep breath and, and leave some of that to focus?
Or w- are those two things not related for you? [00:28:00]
Paula Orrego: That's a really interesting question. So I, I think the anxiety It, it changed when I was in high school. Because now the anxiety was, for example, like I had a note taker, and, um, I had the... I had a, I had a, um, a recording, a, a recording device, and then which then the technology changed, and now we had recording pens.
And so I stood out, right? And I kind of, I kind of mentioned before I was bullied. So now the anxiety was, okay, I feel better, a little better about the school thing, but now, you know, my, my peers can see that I'm different. They know that I'm even more different than I was before because I have a classmate coming up to me with her notes like, "Here you go."
Um, they see... And sometimes I had, um, teachers who would ask me like, like, "What, what is [00:29:00] that?" And I'm like, "You, you know what that is. It's a r- it's a recorder." You know? And but, like, that was, that created a different level of anxiety, new anxieties. Mm. And but in college and in grad school, it did help with the anxiety with, with school, 'cause I didn't, I wasn't afraid afterwards of, "Oh my gosh, did I get, did I get all of the information?
What am I gonna do if I don't get all of the information?" I have the accommodations there to support me.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I will say that anxiety is, um, documented. The so, the, the likelihood of having clinical anxiety or clinical depression if you have developmental language disorder is certainly higher than the likelihood just in the general population.
Um, and I, I think there are probably some interesting and complex reasons for that. I mean, the, the most obvious one is that it's stressful to [00:30:00] deal with developmental language disorder, um, or potentially any other disability. Um, but there is also some evidence that, um, s- the, the tendency towards anxiety is, you know, maybe something there even from birth in the very early developing brain that is not just a reaction to the disability, but it's something about the differences in the way the brain develops that makes people a little more likely to experience anxiety.
And then of course we know that girls are more likely than boys, and teens more likely than young children. And so you put those perfect storms together, and Paula is a teenage girl with a disability. And yeah, it was, I'm sure it was a very trying time. Um-
Paula Orrego: I
Karla K. McGregor: can- Yeah, you were heroic in the way that you managed it really.
I, I think really heroic when you look back at it. Like, I, I, Paula and I have been able to, of course, talk for many hours together over the past few years [00:31:00] and, um, you, you're not, you're not very blameful over the way that people- bullied you and contributed to your anxiety. You don't seem blameful about that.
I think that's amazing.
Paula Orrego: Oh, thank you so much. I think it's-
Karla K. McGregor: I mean, yeah ...
Paula Orrego: I think it's partly years of therapy. Mm-hmm. And I think, um, I think also the, the religion that I grew up in, um, once I had a healthy relationship with it, um, I think that also helped with that, with that mindset. Mm-hmm. And I, I think it just came with time, you know?
I think it just came with time of looking back. There were things that I learned, um, as an adult that I didn't know when I was a child or, or a teenager. Um, and so, you know, I, I come at it now with... [00:32:00] I, I don't, um I don't excuse the behavior because there's no excuse for the behavior, but I, I can understand.
I could put myself in, uh, the other person's shoes, and even if I wouldn't do the same thing they did, I can understand why they did it.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm.
Paula Orrego: Yeah. Hopefully
Karla K. McGregor: that makes
Paula Orrego: sense. Yeah. Yeah.
Karla K. McGregor: Well,
Kate Grandbois: and I, I, I wanna take that as an opportunity to reframe your story, and I'm sure you do this all, all the time in your advocacy and motivational speaker work, you know, reframing this story as opportunities for those of us who know better, you know, every speech pathologist listening, right?
Every SLP who is listening knows better. Um, for those of us who know better, to pause and recognize the complexity of emotion, lived experience, context- Mm ... support networks, resources or lack [00:33:00] of resources, right? Intersectionality. All of these sprinkled variables that, that ig- that contribute to the human experience.
And for those of us who can pause to make space for that, also equally make space for the, for, for protecting and, and advocating
you all tell me. I'm just kind of, like, spitballing here. Mm-hmm. But as speech pathologists within businesses, within organizations, within schools, within hospitals, it is, it can be our role to advocate- Mm ... and to better educate that teacher down the hall. And everybody has a spicy teacher. Mm. Everybody knows there's somebody in the- Mm-hmm
in your office that is a, just a tad grumpy. Mm-hmm. Everybody has them, and it can be our jobs to insert ourselves- Mm ... to prevent, hopefully, at least some of, of these pressures, just because it is so complex. I don't know if that resonated with any of you. Mm. If not, I can retract it from the record
Karla K. McGregor: No, don't retract it Don't retract [00:34:00] it.
No, don't do that. No, I think you're exactly right, and, uh, teachers, it, you know, when it comes to developmental language disorder, teachers are on the front line. Like, they can be our biggest advocates- Mm-hmm ... to help us find children who need services and supports, because the classroom is a primary place that the problem is going to rear its head, because it's just such a verbal environment.
I mean, there's, there's no such thing as a, a lightly verbal classroom, right? Mm. Classrooms are very verbal, and so that's where the child is especially likely to struggle socially and academically. So I think teachers can just be our very best friends in terms of, um, sharing concerns, making referrals. Um, but yeah, but we, we have to, we have to help educate them and know what to look for, and know why it's important to make those referrals.
I think that is where the speech [00:35:00] pathologist's relationship with the teacher colleagues is super important there.
Paula Orrego: Yeah. And w- we had, I think we also talked about in our, um, in our article, we had discussed how teachers for me were, um, kind of an external barrier. They were not, they did not understand my challenges.
Um, the problem was that my school boasted about hiring PhDs as their teachers. And while that's great because they're experts in their field and maybe they taught at the college level, teaching college students and teaching middle and high schoolers is a whole different beast, right? Not, you're not necessarily an expert at teaching middle and high schoolers just 'cause you taught college students.
Um, they, they didn't have a teaching degree for those ages, and so they didn't know how to spot possible learning disabilities. They, they- Yeah ... they didn't know how [00:36:00] to teach in different ways with, to children with varying learning styles and abilities. I did, uh, uh, I did ask teachers for help, but I often didn't receive the help that I, that I needed.
Um, yeah, I-
Kate Grandbois: I think that the, the, there's such a misnomer with credentials, right? 'Cause just 'cause you have a PhD doesn't mean that you're a nice person. Or a compassion- or a compassionate person, or capable of relating to children, or breaking down complex pro- you know, complex ideas into really small parts that can be digested by various, you know, b- learning styles.
Um, and I think that's just another, you know, highlight, another way to highlight the mismatch sometimes between- Like business context, right? Like, oh, well that's a selling point for us. We have PhDs for-
Paula Orrego: Yes ...
Kate Grandbois: everybody should come to my school, right? That, that's, that's not necessarily what's best for everyone.
Right. You know? What the- Mm-hmm ... the things that are in our structures are not [00:37:00] necessarily made for- Mm-hmm ... for the people who consume them.
Paula Orrego: Right. And I think for me, so I'm gonna have to put a trigger, trigger warning to this because we're dealing with, with mental health issues in this part. I was in sixth grade and I went to my history teacher, right?
This was when I was dealing with the bullying. I was not getting a- any accommodations at the time for my learning disability, and I was... This is the part where g- where I was in the down, in the valley. Very much so, and for a long time I was in that valley. And so I started having these thoughts of, of suicide.
And so I talked to my history teacher, because that's what you're taught to do. When you have these feelings, you talk to a trusted adult. Mm. And so, having a pro- a teacher who is not trained for that age range [00:38:00] gives you an answer like, "Well, I'm really glad you understand your feelings," and then nothing happening afterwards
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Mm. Did I... Do you know, did the teacher at least share your concern with your parents?
Paula Orrego: No.
Karla K. McGregor: Oh, my. Yeah.
Paula Orrego: Oh,
Karla K. McGregor: goodness gracious.
Paula Orrego: No. Wow. She didn't. No, she didn't share it with my parents.
Karla K. McGregor: Oh, mm, Paula, mm.
Paula Orrego: My goodness. And so, so this is where, this is where it ties back to if our, if the adults in schools are not educated on learning disabilities and the s- possible subsequent, um, mental health issues that could happen, I'm also a mental health, a mental illness awareness advocate, so that's where I'm putting my little spiel in.
Yeah. Um, if you don't, if you don't educate the teachers in the schools, then you get situations like [00:39:00] this- Mm-hmm ... where it... I al- I almost don't even wanna say you, I was, I slipped through the cracks. It's like I was shoved under the carpet.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I think one of the, sorry, I need to develop my language disorder, but when people have an indivisible, uh, or not an indivisible, sorry, an invisible disability, um, I think there are ten- there are tendencies to ignore it or to chalk it up to, you know, uh, the child is moody or the child is-
Paula Orrego: So true
Karla K. McGregor: you know, whatever. Right? Uh, and not to something that is bigger and more important to pay attention to. And it, it's interesting to me because I, I mean, DLD is certainly invisible. Like, I can't look at Paula and say she has DLD, obviously. Um, but it also is so manifested in so many obvious ways. And so I think we just [00:40:00] need to get to that tipping point where, um, adults, both families and professionals, are just better educated about- What, what these kinds of symptoms could be telling us.
Yes. I don't think people necessarily link the crying back to a language problem, or the bullying back to a language problem, or the... Right? It's just not their first idea that comes to them.
Kate Grandbois: Mm-hmm.
Karla K. McGregor: Um, so that, that's sort of one of my big hopes is that, um, the general public awareness of developmental language disorder will get to where, uh, public awareness of dyslexia is, or public awareness of where ADHD is.
Um, you know, n- the public is not meant to be, um, expert, but at least they know. They have a general sense of what those things are and how they could affect a [00:41:00] child, um, their family, and their adulthood, right? But I think we just, we don't, we're not there yet with developmental language disorder, um, which is another reason why it's so generous of you to tell your story, Paula.
Kate Grandbois: Also, you know, on that same vein of the importance of training, uh, and when I say training, I mean specific education around, um, DLD and as, as you mentioned, the way it might manifest that we might not see right away.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. 'Cause I think that there's a public perception of like, "Oh, you have a hard time reading. No big deal. What's the problem?" Mm-hmm. Just, you know, just get some help reading, right? Yeah. I, I think we tend to not want to see the complexity of feelings, and the other p- side of that is just reminding people to be compassionate and kind.
And I know that that seems like such a small thing, but I think it goes so far where if you learn that someone's having a hard time, don't brush it under the rug. Don't put [00:42:00] people under- Right ... a rug. Yeah. People don't belong under rugs, under no circumstances- ... broadly or simply, right? Yeah. That's true. Um, and I, I think that's another thing- Yeah
that all of us can do as individuals, and I think that takes a lot of personal work. I think it takes a lot of- Mm-hmm ... personal reflection, a lot of personal unpacking- Mm-hmm ... a lot of therapy, a lot of journaling, I don't know, light a candle, go for a walk, whatever you need to do- ... to engage in that self-reflective work to think about- Mm-hmm
how you can show up for other people in a way that actually centers them and show compassion. And unfortunately, that is left out of our training. It is left out of- Mm-hmm ... speech pathology training. It's left out of, I think it's left out of education, uh, teacher training. I'm not a teacher, so I can't say that to confirm.
Mm-hmm. But it's left out of a lot of our, quote-unquote, "helping profession training" because we come, you know, up through these, you know, very academic cycling- Mm-hmm ... old-timey models. Mm-hmm. Um, so [00:43:00] just pulling that thread in terms of takeaways for people who are listening, um, really making sure we're cognizant of making those connections, but also doing the personal work so that we can advocate and, and show up in a way that is meaningful.
Paula Orrego: Yeah. Right. And you might be the only adult in that child's life that they feel comfortable- Mm-hmm ... speaking to. So please- Mm-hmm ... do not be the, the adult who pushes them away, because then- Right ... they have nobody. And then w- I was, you know, I was left feeling like, "Wow, I don't matter. I don't matter if this t- I told them my feelings," and the teacher s- it gave me the message that it doesn't matter whether I, I'm alive or not.
It doesn't, it doesn't make a difference to them. Mm-hmm. You have to be there for that child and tell them that th- their presence on this earth, in the school or wherever is important.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm.
Paula Orrego: Yeah.
Amy Wonkka: Yeah, what a [00:44:00] heavy-
Karla K. McGregor: It's ...
Amy Wonkka: what a heavy experience that was for you, for young Paula. Yeah. Um, in that school, where you're in the school and everybody's a, everybody's a doctor, it's fancy.
There's also no speech pathologist, right? There's no- Yeah ... speech pathologist there, so-
Kate Grandbois: Yeah ...
Amy Wonkka: we can make, like, sort of a prediction that perhaps those teachers really didn't even know to think- Mm-hmm ... that DLD could be a thing, right? They, they really didn't e- So, I, so one takeaway for me, as someone who, who works in public schools now, is, like, that's a nice thing if you're also a school-based SLP.
Like, that's- Mm ... a possibly a helpful role that we can play for our bigger school communities, too. Is just making sure, you know, that our colleagues are aware of these likely invisible disability, right? Like, we don't see the, that you spent your whole 12 hours of your weekend and working on your homework and, you know, we just- Right
see these, [00:45:00] like, small moments. Um, so part of what we SLPs in school-based places or other places that are, like, communities where, where kids or adults are going on the, on a regular basis, is just to help raise that awareness, too. Mm-hmm. Right? And I know one of, one of the learning objectives was thinking about that, like, sort of the broad-reaching effects of DLD, right?
It's not, it's not just how you do on your assignments, it's how you're showing up in your social life. Right. It's what your academics look like. I don't know if there was anything else, either Paula, Karla, you guys wanted to add, that are sort of those little things that, that we could just let our colleagues know about to, like, look for, that are look fors.
Like, if you see a pa- Like, everybody has a bad day. Like, we've, we've all- Yeah, yeah. It's okay ... had bad moments, right? Yes. But, like, are there, are there patterns that we might not pick up unless we're looking for them?
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm. Mm. I, I think in the earlier grades, um, in particular, uh, children [00:46:00] with DLD often don't understand the verbal directions that the teacher is giving.
And so if you notice a child who is participating and doing what they're supposed to do, but seemingly because they're looking at what others are doing, right? So they don't really understand you're supposed to get up and get your coat until everyone gets up and gets their coat, and then they do it, right?
So kind of like watching others to sort of see what you're meant to do, and so you might be a step or two behind because you're not really following the words, you're following y- your friends. You know, you're kind of... I think children who, um, I so often hear, "Oh, she's just very shy. Oh, she's just very shy."
Well, people do, are shy. I mean, that's a thing. That's a thing. Um, I think I'm on the shy side. Um, so I'm not saying you can't be shy, but it- Oftentimes a child with DLD will, or even a teen with DLD, will [00:47:00] kind of withdraw because the, the language interactions are going too quickly, or they're too complex to follow.
And so just kind of withdrawing, staying quiet, staying on the edge of things. You look like you're shy. You might not really be a shy person. Um, I think if, if you're very extroverted at home but ar- very introverted at school, home tends to be the easier environment because you're with familiar people, and, um, you have a lot of routines there and, uh, lots going on.
Uh, that could be a sign. I know in the article, Paula, you talked about how you consider yourself an extrovert, but at school you became an introvert, and I think that's sort of a, um- Or people- ... a way to compensate or a way to mask, even.
Paula Orrego: Yeah. Uh, yeah, people perceive me as an introvert because I was- Yeah
like I just, uh, I just felt uncomfortable with my language and saying the wrong thing, and then that, yeah, [00:48:00] that getting bullied because of that, so I might as well just-
Karla K. McGregor: Right. Exactly ...
Paula Orrego: retreat.
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah. And then of course, reading problems. So we all know that reading matters. Schools know reading matters.
Parents know reading matters. Everyone gets the importance of reading, and if the child is having difficulty reading, then really they should be screened for not only dyslexia, but also DLD. Um, some children will have both. Some will have one or the other. Um, what, what will sometimes happen is the child with DLD who does not have dyslexia, and I would argue that's you, Paula, you don't have any signs of dyslexia, um-
Amy Wonkka: Yeah.
Karla K. McGregor: They'll do fine in the learning to read period, where you're learning to map the, the sounds onto the letters, like the phoneme-grapheme correspondences, but they'll start to fall apart in the learning, uh, reading to learn after that period, where when you're supposed to be much more dependent on text for your learning, well, then [00:49:00] that's gonna be difficult, because you've got to comprehend what you've decoded, um, or you've got to, if you're writing, you've got to construct those sentences and that organization and those ideas into a verbal format.
So, uh, reading comprehension problems would be a huge sign of dysle- of, um, DLD as well. Yeah.
Amy Wonkka: Paula, it just made me think about your story and how you effectively got discharged from school-based speech pathology, like, kind of right around that transition, right? The, like- Yeah ... you're transitioning it. Yeah It was around third grade, right?
You're starting to- Mm-hmm ... read to learn, and they're like, "Ah, you're good."
Paula Orrego: Well, I was, I was, I was discharged from, from, uh, I was discharged from, yeah, Stella at the, uh, third gr- uh, third grade. Mm-hmm. And it, you know, I ... Looking back on it, I think I could have, I think I could have qualified. I don't know, 'cause I, I, I don't have an SLP in, in sixth grade Paula to meet and test her.
Mm-hmm. But I think I could [00:50:00] have ... You correct me if I'm wrong, Carla, but I think I could have qualified for speech services then in order to, um, to keep up with the demands of middle school. Exactly what you were saying- Yeah ... of, uh, there was so much more r- uh- Right ... reading to learn.
Karla K. McGregor: That's right. Yeah, and that's where you started to sink again.
So it's just that, yeah, you meet new developmental challenges and it, it seems like, oh, my goodness, it's back. But the thing is, it would have never gone. It never went anywhere, right? You were just in a period of your life where you were managing fine, you know? You had what you needed. Yeah.
Kate Grandbois: I ... And it, despite my internal motivation to travel back in time and redouble my hugging efforts to sixth grade Paula, I, I wonder if there are, there's room in this conversation because you're, you know, a CF, but almost, [00:51:00] probably almost a licensed speech language pathologist, right?
Karla K. McGregor: Almost.
Kate Grandbois: Wh- which speaks to so much resilience, um, in the, in what you've faced and, you know, a- all of the things that you've shared in this story. Uh, and I wonder if there are components of that that you'd like to share as, again, lessons for the people who are listening as advocates
Paula Orrego: Could you restate that question, please?
Kate Grandbois: Yeah. So thinking about what you've come through and the strength- Mm-hmm ... that you had to, um, that you carried with you and the resilience that you showed in the face of all of the challenges and the barriers. As a reminder to the speech pathologists listening who might be working with a sixth grade young Paula, I think it's important for us to remember that those strengths are there, that that resilience is there.[00:52:00]
Uh, and I wonder if you could tell us a little bit more about your resilience and how- Mm-hmm ... those components of strength shone through and guided you through as a lesson to those of us who can continue to advocate, knowing that those strengths are inherent as, as part of your, of, of humanity.
Paula Orrego: Yeah. Yeah.
Well- Let's see. I think
One of my internal strengths that took me a long time to discover was, uh, that I am a, I, I am a natural learner, lifelong learner. I, I want to learn. I wanna learn everything. I'm naturally very curious. Um, I mean, I went into, going into my undergrad years debating between multiple majors and minors. Um, and realizing that I, I, I do love [00:53:00] to learn actually, and I can tease that away from the trauma of school itself.
Um, you know, I, uh, when I was in school and seeing how, seeing how much I was struggling, I I, I, I felt like I was too stupid to succeed, and I basically, I said, "I'm, I'm just going to college because I'm supposed to." And now y- going into a sup- going into a supportive environment in my undergrad years, in grad school, and getting, um, getting that support from my accommodations and from my professors, I realized, yeah, I, I could keep doing this, and I really do.
I, I have a, a natural, uh, I have a perpetual learner within me. A perpetual student [00:54:00] within me. Um, and it, it, it took me, uh, it took me a C+ in my first college essay in school and then getting, uh, going to a s- uh, it's like a s- getting a solid foundation in a college writing class w- took all that to realize, oh, I am actually good at writing if I'm taught the basics, if I'm taught directly how to do it, right?
Clear instruction. Um, and yeah, it, it's like what you all said, I, I, it took me time to discover I am a resilient person.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm. Your motivation for learning is very high, I think, Paula. Yeah. I, I certainly see that in you, and I think it's carried you really far, and it's, it's good. It's fortunate for us all that, that the traumatic aspects of school didn't dampen that, that interest, um, that drive to learn.
I wonder if you... You, you mentioned your [00:55:00] accommodations, and, um, probably your listeners all know this, but they might not know how to navigate it. So one real difference between, uh, elementary and secondary school versus post-secondary if you go to college is, um, that in the early years we're meant to find you, right?
We're meant to find children who need support and make sure they get the supports they need. But at the post-secondary level- The student themselves has to reach out and say, "I need support. I need accommodations. I'm, I have some learning needs." Um, and so that burden kind of shifts away from the burden on the school to the burden on the student.
Uh, I wonder if you would speak a little bit about, uh, was it scary to ask for accommodations? How did you do it? Did it go well? Yeah. Did you know, you know, what, what was that like?
Paula Orrego: Yeah. I think because I had [00:56:00] to, I learned to advocate for myself and the things that were happening to me in middle and high school, it didn't, it wasn't difficult for me to show up before
Uh, show up, I mean, by show up, I mean via phone call. Uh, but show up to my university before my, my start of my freshman year and be like, "Hi, my name is Paula. May I speak to the disability office?" Right. And I, so it, it ... And I remember the, the, the lady that I spoke with, she was like, "This is so refreshing.
You, this is so refreshing. Usually, we get the parents calling- "... for the accommodations of their- Mm-hmm ... of their children. It's just so nice to hear it, it coming directly from you." Yeah. And I'm like, "Well, yeah, because I've had to do this for- Yeah ... all my life."
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah, yeah. I think you are unusual, um, in that regard because I, this was a long time ago, maybe [00:57:00] 2013-ish, um, I was fortunate enough to be part of a group studying, um, university level accommodations.
And what we learned is that most students who have been on IEPs in school before, and then they've, let's say, graduated off them or been dismissed from caseloads, they go to college raring to go, and they feel like, and, and rightly so, they feel like, "I don't need any help anymore. I haven't been on an IEP for several years," right?
Um, "I can do this." But what we have to remember, again, is when you meet new developmental challenges is when that impairment raises its head again. And so, so many of the student records that we examined indicated that, um, students- Would not request accommodations until they started to fail.
Kate Grandbois: Mm.
Karla K. McGregor: They started to fail their classes, and that's when they or their parents or they together, um, sought out [00:58:00] help.
And so I, I think you're proactive in a way that a lot of people aren't. Um-
Paula Orrego: I think I was- You know? I think I was thoroughly- Yeah ... traumatized by m- my, uh, eighth grade final in history, and that was- Yeah. D- d- you're right, though. Like, I did, it did have, I did have to fail that in order to get my accommodations.
And then going into college I was like, "I am not going to." You're not going to fail. "I'm not going to fail again. I'm not going to fail again."
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah. Yeah. Also, a lot of college students who have developmental language disorder or other learning needs, um, take longer to finish school, and that, I think, was one of your strategies.
Yeah. Do you wanna talk a little bit about that?
Paula Orrego: Oh, yeah. Yeah. I... So, so- Sorry, thinking. Yeah. It, I ended up graduating not within that four-year timeline, partly because I wanted to learn everything, yes, that's true. [00:59:00] But also because I did not wanna take a lot of classes at the same time-
Karla K. McGregor: Right ...
Paula Orrego: knowing I would need more time than my peers to do my homework and study for tests.
And then I went on to grad school and I, where I continued that same trend of fewer classes per semester.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm, mm-hmm, yeah.
Amy Wonkka: I do wonder, too, again, like, I'm just, like, with my school person hat on, but I, like, we, we come up with transition plans. We have students come to their IEPs, you know, once they're in high school.
Um, and, and it does also make me wonder, and maybe some other listeners are wondering, too, to make sure that we're actively engaging in that conversation before the student heads off- Mm-hmm ... you know, and making sure we're having a real conversation about, like, "Okay, this is your IEP. These are our goals and objectives that we're, you know, coming up with together.
We want you to be able to feel comfortable doing these things independently." Um, 'cause I also feel like that's ki- that's kind of, like, an abrupt shift if you haven't been working [01:00:00] with a team who, like, you feel like you're an active member of and you're participating as, as a member of that team, to just be like, "Oh, boop, there you go.
Now you do it on your own." Mm-hmm. Um, I wonder, too, about, we have our last learning objective really talks about some of those supports, not just, you know, for academics, but also kind of in the workplace. And I'd imagine some of those same skills, like, come up. I don't know, Paula, if you had anything you wanted to share about, like, your experiences through your, like, placements or anything like that.
Paula Orrego: Yeah. You know, um, in, in my placements and in my clinical fellowship, I have found that, um, people are, are used to, or maybe not used to, but are aware of the accommodations that are available to people with physical disabilities or, um, with ADHD, other types of neurodivergence, right? But DLD, they kind of don't know what to do with that.
[01:01:00] And y- they've even forgotten, and f- and I've had placement supervisors who've said, "Oh, that's right, I forgot you have DLD," right? Because it's an in- it's just like Karla said. It's an invisible diagnosis. Mm-hmm. It's an invisible disorder. And so there's, there isn't, uh, there isn't training for that in grad school for, um, or for, uh, placement or CF supervisors.
Um, but Karla, you had told me once in a phone conversation about, um, uh, what kinds of, uh, uh, accommodations or kinds of things- Mm-hmm ... that supervisors can do to help DLDers, right? Mm-hmm.
Karla K. McGregor: Yeah. I mean, I, I'm switching hats here to a person who has, um, um, you know, led teams. Um, and- It, so some, uh, requests for accommodations that I think have been pretty effective in the workplace, um, [01:02:00] asking for the quietest office on the hall.
Absolutely. Uh, you know, that's, you know, like, that's an example because if you're a person who has ADHD or otherwise have, you know, are easily distracted from your work, um, or permission to wear, um, you know, noise counseling- canceling headphones or, you know, those kinds of things can be useful. Um, I know of some people who have had, um, um, uh, editor, uh, support in the workplace to make sure final products are...
I mean, that be- has become easier with, um, well, I guess, AI technology for checking work, but still sometimes there's nothing like an actual human, uh, to make sure that, you know, your final work products are p- are polished. Mm-hmm. And that could be a potential accommodation. Um, I guess the point is that everyone is different, and what will be supportive will be different.
[01:03:00] Mm-hmm. But it's gonna be the burden on the, on the employee to approach HR or their supervisor to ask for these and to work out a plan. I've always found HR to be very, uh, they're, they're not necessarily knowledgeable about every possible disability that someone could have. I don't know how they could be, but I, at least in my limited experience, I found HR to be very, um, willing to, to try to help and find the accommodations that their employees need.
I mean, they're obligated by law to do that,
Kate Grandbois: so. I w- I was just about to say, the, it's the law, right? I mean, I think- Exactly. Yeah ... most H- most as a speak, now I'm switching hats as a person who owns a business, um- Mm-hmm ... and has employees, there are a lot of really important regulatory frameworks in place- Mm-hmm
specifically to protect and ensure protections for, um- Mm-hmm ... you know, people who have disabilities in the workplace. [01:04:00] So I think advocacy is important, and it's also a completely justifiable right. Uh, and so- Mm-hmm ... your HR person, if you know someone, if you are listening and you have DLD or you have a colleague, um, and you are feeling like, "Well, my HR person isn't gonna know," they will find out.
They will Google it. Mm-hmm. They will use whatever tools they have at their disposal because it is the law. Um, and I think- Mm-hmm ... that's an important feather in the cap of advocacy, right, is, is the structures that we- I agree ... lean on to make sure that those things happen.
Karla K. McGregor: Mm-hmm. Fully agree. Yeah.
Kate Grandbois: Well, in our last couple of minutes I was just gonna ask our closing question, unless you all have something else that you'd like to share
Karla K. McGregor: Well, I'd like to share a big thank you to you two, because I think this is an amazing format, and Paula and I are all about advocacy and trying to make, make [01:05:00] contacts healthier, uh, for those, um, who are having, uh, disabilities of any sort.
But in particular, our focus is developmental language disorders. So thank you so much for letting us highlight the work that we do and the ideas that we have to share. I appreciate it.
Kate Grandbois: Yes. Thank you so, so much. Well, you're, you're so welcome. It's been so wonderful to have you. Are there any closing words of wisdom or, you know, for anybody who is listening who is reflecting on some of these, um, complexities for the first time, or thinking about ways that they can enga- engage in more deep, meaningful advocacy work within their workplaces for their clients, their students, their colleagues?
Do you have suggestions or places to start that might be helpful?
Karla K. McGregor: Well, social media is really growing around DLD. Um, so you might look in your favorite social media venues to see, uh, communities, uh, where people are, are sharing lived experiences and ideas. [01:06:00] There's a group called Radld, R-A-D-L-D, .org, and they do international advocacy work for DLD awareness.
And then, um, the group that's, um, near and dear to my heart is dldandme.org. So I chair that organization, and we're all volunteers, and our job is to get accessible information out about DLD that, um, teens can read, parents can read, teachers can read. You know, anyone who, who cares about DLD can go there for some evidence-based information that we try our best to write in a way that's really accessible and, and interesting and, um...
And you can also listen to it if you don't feel like reading it. You can push the button, and it will read to you. So that's dldandme.org.
Paula Orrego: Mm-hmm. And I think a, a parting thought that I would like to give is, first, DLD is a lifelong condition, but that doesn't [01:07:00] mean that the person's language level will stay the same for their entire lives.
Like, we saw with me that, um, I did well enough to graduate, and then I had difficulties, and then I got better once I had, um, the foundations writing class in college, and then I lear- learned I like to write. And so i- it can wax and wane. Um, and then with external support, people who are growing up with DLD can thrive.
Karla K. McGregor: Absolutely.
Kate Grandbois: I love ending on that note. Thank you- Me too ... so much for being here. Um, some quick reminders for everyone listening. Um, if you are listening to this episode and you'd like to earn ASHA CEUs, please go to the website to take the post-test or learn more about our financial and non-financial disclosures.
A quick thank you to the team who helps put this podcast together, Dr. Anna Paula Mumme, who makes our ASHA CEUs possible. Uh, Darren Lopez, who is our [01:08:00] production assistant. Tracy Callahan, our advisory board liaison. Dr. Mary Beth Schmidt, who provides consultation to our peer review process. Our advisory board.
Last but not least, Paula and Karla. Thank you so much for being here. I have learned, we both have learned so much from both of you today, and we're extremely grateful for your time.
Amy Wonkka: Thank you both. Thank you very much.
Outro
Announcer: Thank you so much for joining us in today's episode, as always, you can use this episode for ASHA CEUs. You can also potentially use this episode for other credits, depending on the regulations of your governing body. To determine if this episode will count towards professional development in your area of study.
Please check in with your governing bodies or you can go to our website, www.slpnerdcast.com all of the references and information listed throughout the course of the episode will be listed in the show notes. And as always, if you have any questions, please email us at [email protected]
thank you so much for joining us and we [01:09:00] hope to welcome you back here again soon.
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