Community, Connection, and Social Justice in Speech-Language Pathology (Part 1)

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Intro

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Episode

Kate Grandbois: Hello, everyone. Welcome to SLP Nerdcast. We are really excited for today's episode. We are here with two expert guests to discuss social justice curriculum in schools. Please welcome Lauren Tavares and Sarah Hasse. Hi. 

Sarah Hahesy: Hi. 

Amy Wonkka: Lauren and Sarah, you are here to discuss social justice in speech language pathology, but before we get started, can you please tell us just a little bit about 

Lauren Tavares: yourselves?

Sure. Thanks for having us. Hi, I'm Lauren. Um, I am a school based SLP. I work in a kindergarten through eighth grade public school. Um, I work in classrooms from Kindergarten through third grade and I get to teach in an autism program with kindergarten through eighth graders. [00:03:00] One of the best parts about my job is pushing in and doing lessons with excellent people 

Sarah Hahesy: like Sarah.

Um, and I'm a third grade teacher and I'm going into my 17th year of teaching and social justice work is basically one of the biggest highlights of my job and I love that I get to collaborate with Lauren and create this. Wonderful curriculum for our students 

Kate Grandbois: here at the nerdcast. We love it when individuals in different disciplines get together and collaborate.

So we're really happy to have both of your perspectives here to teach us more about social justice. Before we get into the good parts of the conversation, I do need to read our learning objectives and disclosures. I will get through that as quickly as I can. Learning objective number one defines social justice and how it relates to ethics in speech language pathology.

Learning objective number two list two components of infrastructure that support social justice curriculums in schools and learning [00:04:00] objective number three describe how social justice is related to curriculum in an educational setting disclosures Sarah's financial disclosures Sarah works for a public school and is paid to facilitate a seed group.

Sarah received an honorarium for participating in this course. Sarah's non financial disclosures. Sarah has no non financial relationships to disclose. Lauren's financial disclosures. Lauren is an employee of a public school and is paid to facilitate a seed group. Lauren received an honorarium for participating in this course.

Lauren's non financial disclosures, Lauren is a member of the American Speech and Hearing Association. Kate, that's me. I am the owner and founder of Grand Bois Therapy and Consulting LLC and co founder of SLP Nerdcast. My non financial disclosures, I am a member of ASHA SIG 12 and I serve on the AAC Advisory Group from Massachusetts Advocates for Children.

I'm also a member of the Berkshire Association for Behavior Analysis and Therapy. 

Amy Wonkka: Amy, that's me. My financial disclosures are that I'm an employee of a public school system and [00:05:00] co founder of SLP Nerdcast, and my non financial disclosures are that I'm a member of ASHA, Special Interest Group 12, and I participate in the AAC Advisory Group for Massachusetts Advocates for Children.

All right, Sarah and Lauren, can you please tell us a little bit about your journeys and what led you to learn more and to want to learn more about social justice curriculums? 

Lauren Tavares: Sure. Um, so for me, um, and I think for a lot of people, this has kind of been a lifelong journey. Um, I grew up in a suburb of Boston and I was one of very, like one of very few people of color in my town.

I was the only black person in my grade. Um, and it was the nineties and the predominant practice was to be colorblind. And I found that really harmful growing up. Um, it really ignored a lot of my livid experience and what I was going through when and what I brought to school with me as a learner. Um, and then I went on personal journey myself and when I came to work at my current [00:06:00] school as an adult.

Um, I was really lucky because Sarah and a few other colleagues had already started meeting together and collaborating around social justice in the classroom. And it was so exciting. Um, it was really exciting to see people already doing this work and, and start to be part of creating a really kind of robust educational experience for our students.

And especially where my own had really 

Sarah Hahesy: been lacking. Yeah. Um, when I started teaching, um, the principal at the time was very into having talks. Um, About anti racism and often our faculty meetings would be about that. So that's kind of when I mean, I think I had little bits of this throughout my own like childhood.

But I grew up as a white woman and, you know, a lot of it. I also was indoctrinated with being colorblind and not talking about it and ignoring it. So when I got to my third year, I took a course that kind of just like [00:07:00] changed my whole life. And from there, it just led me to do more and more social justice courses.

And, um, one of them was white people challenging racism, which is out. Outside of like the Cambridge, um, they have an out of school sort of thing for adults. And, um, I took that course and then I met with a bunch of people at my school, and we wanted to really just form an accountability group with each other.

And, um, we found this great resource called. Raising race conscious children and, um, where they have like a list of strategies that you can try and it's, you know, it's geared towards parents and talking to their kids about race or about ableism or whatever. And, um, we just really loved it we had some training with them, and we decided as a group we wanted to read a picture book, and we [00:08:00] wanted to name race.

And then we wanted to meet every month just to see how we were doing and then it's kind of grown from there where now we, um, We did take a little bit of a break during COVID, but then we came back and did it again. But we do find time during our collab time to meet at least once a month. And, um, it's not a lot of time, which we've always wanted more and more and more time.

But, um, it's just been this amazing thing where we've built this community that is all driven to be, you know, race conscious or just like, Just conscious and able to talk about difficult things with our students and our staff. And because of that, our principal, um, What was it three years ago, Lauren, she asked us to do, um, you know, the seed leader training, which is seeking educational equity and diversity.

And we both did it and we have trained now. I think about 30 people in our school, and it's the [00:09:00] only school in our district that has had this much input and I think it's because we've like built this small group that Ben has like really expanded out and it's. It's amazing. And it's so empowering and awesome to see that our school is so driven to do this.

And I love this work because there's nothing better than, you know, reading a book with a student or students and having conversations with them and then just seeing them feel seen and being understood. And, um, it's just, it's the best. So that's how I came here. 

Kate Grandbois: So you've mentioned the, that you both are seed trainers, seed facilitators.

I'm not quite sure what the terminology is. And you mentioned this training. I know you're going to mention it a few more times as this episode unfolds. Can you tell us a little bit about the structure of the training you went through? I presume it wasn't a one hour webinar that you took. I assume it was a little bit more intense than that.

Can you tell us a little bit about it? [00:10:00] 

Sarah Hahesy: Do you want to start Lauren? 

Lauren Tavares: Sure. Um, so Sarah and I took this training through the National Seed Project a few summers ago, um, and they train educators in, um, how to work in, in areas of social justice in schools. Um, and our job, we got training to facilitate groups for, um, our colleagues to learn about, uh, social justice and really think about yourselves and, um, think about how you.

How you grew up, like where your biases are, what you're bringing to the table in the classroom, those kinds of things. And, um, and that's how we do our groups. Our training was, um, was two weeks over a summer, um, where we, where we just went full in on learning and we had groups and we had, um, we had our own sort of seminars that we really engaged in with all different, all different groups from people all over the U S.

Sarah Hahesy: And the focus of it is to tell our stories, and to really [00:11:00] get to know each other through our stories. And that's kind of what they train us and there's 10 different modules that we go through every month with our group and it's really intensive, but it's always like whenever we have a meeting. We're like, Oh my God, it's three hours.

But then at the end, everyone was like, that's awesome. This is amazing. And it really is. It's been, um, it's been so awesome to do it and to do it with Lauren, because she's just such a great collaborator. Thank you so much for 

Kate Grandbois: sharing more about the training. I think it was just important to share that this is available.

This is a resource that's out there. Um, in case anyone, as we move through some of this content wants to learn more about it, and we'll link all of that in the show notes as well. I wonder if you could start us off with some of the fundamentals, for example, what is social justice? I think a lot of us have heard this term, particularly in the last few years, um, but tell us a little bit [00:12:00] in more depth what social justice 

Sarah Hahesy: is.

Um, the definition that Lauren and I like to use as that social justice is about distributing resources fairly and treating all students equitably so that they feel safe and secure, um, physically and psychologically, and we got that definition from the National Educators Association. And what that looks like to us is that in schools.

We just want everyone's learning to be equitable and their needs to be met and for them to feel whole in the classroom and the school. 

Amy Wonkka: And I think that connects us with the concept of oppression, which is an institutional barrier. I don't know if you guys want to talk a little bit about that too and how it connects with social justice.

Lauren Tavares: Sure. Um, I mean, oppression is a huge factor in thinking about social justice and how to teach. Um, and institutional oppression is really the systemic mistreating of a social [00:13:00] identity group. And a lot of times, especially right now in society, we're thinking a lot about race. Um, but it's really important to recognize that we are talking about many different social identity groups that includes race.

That also includes gender and gender identity, class ability, um, ability level, sexual orientation, and many more groups. And then because we are whole people, oftentimes, uh, we ha we identify with more than one of those groups. And so it's also the intersection of where those groups, how those groups really, um, how we identify and how those groups impact 

Kate Grandbois: us.

And I know one of the main things we want to talk about today is how all of this relates to education. I mean, I know we haven't truly gotten there yet, but you can already see a very obvious connection here. If your definition is related to equitable distribution of resources and making children or students feel safe and secure that is required in [00:14:00] schools for, for children to, or I keep saying children, but students to.

Engage in engage with their curriculum. Um, and I know our primary audience is speech pathologists who are working with students who are presumably on IEPs or getting some additional support, which brings us to something else that you wanted to highlight, which is ableism. So what can you tell us a little bit about ableism and how this loops back to concepts of oppression and social justice?

Lauren Tavares: Sure. Um, well, well, I have my own lived experience as an SLP. The way I first came to this work is through working, um, in areas of ableism. Um, one, that's, that's, I mean, that's where we're trained. We're trained with, um, working with people with all different ability levels. Um, and I think, We all know it's really important to advocate for our students and our clients.

And ableism really being the discrimination and prejudice against people with disabilities. [00:15:00] And that includes physical, cognitive, and mental health.

Amy Wonkka: When we think about the curriculum and the work that you're doing in your schools. What are some key questions or early talking points that you used in your conversations with your colleagues to sort of lay the groundwork for people understanding these key concepts? So some of the ideas just underlying social justice in general and oppression and ableism, um, and helping people engage in that conversation at the very beginning.

Um, 

Sarah Hahesy: I think this is answering the question. Um, but we do a lot of like identity work first. You know, kind of getting to know who yourself you like who you are. And then we kind of connect at least what I do in the classroom is do a lot of like windows and mirrors work which is language from seed. A window is how you're looking into you know a part of someone's [00:16:00] world that is new to you.

And whereas a mirror is something that you are, you see reflected in yourself. And so, first you need to know who you are, and then. You can start to like see how you are similar to someone or how you're different. And, um, it's, it's been, I mean, I don't know if we do that in our seed group. I don't know if like our school does it totally with our whole staff, but, um, we're working on making sure we do more of those things, um, with our staff, but I always start the school year with it.

Um, just so my students get to know each other, um, and what I'm expecting from them and what they want out of the classroom. 

Lauren Tavares: And I think that's the beginning for us as SLPs too. That's where I really come in and support in the classroom as well. It's those perspective taking skills that we work on, conversational abilities, um, understanding of others, developing empathy, [00:17:00] basic routine following, and learning the classroom and developing as they develop that community is those really foundational skills are so important.

Kate Grandbois: And of course, all of this is very closely tied to ethics, right? I mean, I know as speech pathologists, we have an ethical code that we are required to abide by. And I'm sure in education, there are other components of ethics that guide your work as a teacher. Um, as a general educator, what can you tell us about the overarching connections between our work considering ableism, oppression, and social justice and 

Lauren Tavares: ethics?

I mean, it really relates to knowing the whole child and knowing who you're working with. Um, we need to understand our students whole profiles, who they are, where they're coming from, what they're dealing with, and what they bring to school with them, and also advocate for their needs and through social justice, we Um, we [00:18:00] understand those identity groups that students are a part of, and it helps us understand them.

Students, all students really deserve to have a learning space where they feel seen and represented and safe. And that is the work that we're trying to do when we create a community that really supports our students. 

Sarah Hahesy: And observationally, what I've seen more and do in my classroom is bring awareness to students who might not work with an SLP or, or a special educator, and just have them learn about neurodiversity, and you know what they can expect, or what they might see and, um, And how you can include those students and how you can interact with them.

And, um, she's really done an amazing job developing this curriculum over the past few years. And we had like a very magical moment this year together, where we, she taught her neurodiversity, you know unit, and, um, You know, [00:19:00] along with like the community building we had done and all of that, we had students sharing their communication challenges with the class, which they had been very reluctant at the beginning of the year and then by the end, they're like, Oh, I want you all to know this about me and the class was like, Oh, cool, you know, it was like a really just like a conversation.

It wasn't like a big deal. It's just, it was beautiful. And, um, You know, and it, you know, it influenced other people to share what they're, you know, working on and, and, you know, that's what we want for them, you know, to, like, see each other and be aware of each other so that we can make these spaces where everyone feels safe and whole and represented.

I think kids are 

Lauren Tavares: really, really receptive to these discussions. Like they're, as soon as we open up the discussion, like they are, they're ready to dive in and say like, so how do we help in the classroom? They've come up with ideas for students that I've worked with for a long time in areas that I've worked with for a long time that I've never thought of.

They're like, oh, we should have that here or we should do [00:20:00] this for our friends. Um, and they're really, they're really ready. They want to be part of this community, um, that we're building.

Sarah Hahesy: And just like naming race, like naming, you know, neurodiversity, naming all those different parts of people. Um, it's really reassuring to students too, because they like to know things and they like to know people and, um, it makes them feel like, oh yeah, I've seen that or, oh, I've never seen that.

And it's. It's really nice, especially because we have such a diverse school. So like it really helps them navigate their school. 

Kate Grandbois: Everything you're saying makes me reflect on the title of this episode, which is Community Connection and Social Justice. What can you tell us about how concepts of community and https: otter.

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Lauren Tavares: I mean, the first thing is is that you need a lot of [00:21:00] support to really push forward in this area. Um, and it's hard. And I think that the first thing for me was finding my community within the school. I'm finding co workers that help keep me accountable to my work finding people that I can go and talk to who are on board and also working on this in their classrooms as well.

Finding support within administration was huge for us. And then also just really thinking about the community we have in our school, thinking about what our students homes look like, what our students backgrounds look like, and what the families are, are doing 

Sarah Hahesy: at home. Yeah, and, um, we've been very fortunate that we've had so much funding as well to build this community and to get more training and to, um, be able to continue this work.

Um, we, we were very lucky that our district paid for our seed training and all the courses I [00:22:00] took in the beginning of my, you know, teaching career was all covered by the district. So, we do work in a district that is very focused on equity, it's actually one of our core values.

And so that's, that's something that's built in for us that some people may not actually have but it's been really important. I think and pushing us forward to have that, but I honestly couldn't continue this work if I didn't have people like Lauren and the people at our school who were doing like the small group stuff and working together.

Amy Wonkka: And I think if you're listening and you're in a less resource, a less well resourced district, um, there are, I don't know if either of you have thoughts about other ways that people can sort of pursue this education, you know, if you don't have that level of financial backing from your district, I think, you know, to, to Lauren's part, piece about, The importance of having coworkers who are forming that community with you.

Um, you know, I think that that's [00:23:00] something you can potentially do. You still need administrative support to some degree for the time. Um, but I think, you know, it sounds like you guys went through a lot of training, professional development on this journey. Um, I don't know if you know of any resources for people who might not be able to get that piece of infrastructure support in place.

Sarah Hahesy: Yeah. Um, No, I mentioned this before, but raising race conscious children is a really great website, you can go to, um, learning for justice is another really great one, um, that we use a lot. There's just so many books on this. So, uh, something that was the most popular of all of our like meetings that we used to have and still have our whenever we had a book club.

So we would choose like a fiction book or a nonfiction book and we would read it and talk about it together. We also used to like listen to podcasts and maybe share that out with each other. Um, but books are always, I [00:24:00] feel like in the classroom and out of the classroom a great way to start and grow your knowledge in this area.

And I know you 

Kate Grandbois: all are going to come back and do a part to talking a little bit more specifically about components of the curriculum and maybe this question fits in with that. Um, but I wonder if you could tell us a little bit about. Any, any strategies you might recommend for someone who's listening, who maybe wants to bring this curriculum into their district, but is maybe the first person to consider something like this or anticipates a little bit of pushback from administrators.

What are some of the benefits of bringing this into a new in bringing this into an infrastructure as a new concept? Or what are some selling points that someone might be able to bring to their administrations? Oh, 

Sarah Hahesy: go ahead, Lauren. 

Lauren Tavares: Well, something that worked for us, like Sarah [00:25:00] said, in our, in our district, equity is a core value.

A lot of districts have language that say what their values and plans are. Some of these kind of definitions can lead to a lot of real performative work, especially if we're not pushing. And so, I think that being able to use those words and advocate for yourself, um, by saying like we, we talked about equity.

This is, this is in our core values and really being clear about why you're doing what you're doing is really the first step, um, in really fighting for what you're doing. 

Sarah Hahesy: And I also think you can, if there's any pushback on that, you can always do it as part of your like building of your community. In your classroom, because you know if you do a lot of identity work.

It's not necessarily like going to raise red flags, it's because students are sharing about themselves, and you're learning about each other. [00:26:00] And they get to know each other they get to know where their names came from they share all these things and like through that you're like learning other people's stories which then grows your empathy and compassion for people in the world.

So, you can do a lot of that there's so many great books that you can read with your students. And, you know, you can, you know, buy yourself or choose to find people at your school who you could be like, okay, let's work on this strategy this year. And you don't have to overwhelm yourself but that's what we did we wanted to name race in picture books and do one a week like that was our goal.

And we ended up doing more than that. But that's where we started. So you can start small and it could just also. I know a lot of people just want to work on their own and just like listen to podcasts. You know, do readings, find articles, read books, um, you know, fiction and nonfiction, um, just so that they can grow their awareness as well.

Lauren Tavares: I think the biggest part is [00:27:00] starting where you're comfortable too. Um, I, for me, I, there's, there can be this kind of misconception that as a person of color that I feel comfortable walking in and talking about race. That was not always the case. I did a lot of learning to get to where I do feel comfortable in that area.

But as an SLP. I felt comfortable going in and talking to kids about the areas that I worked in because that's where our training is. Um, so the first thing that I ever did in the area of social justice was, um, I talked to our guidance counselor at our school and we were looking at the fact that our school has an autism program and we weren't talking about autism with the kids.

Um, and we weren't talking about neurodiversity. And so that was the first thing we did. We sat down with a group of second graders and said, we're gonna talk about this today, and. It's really validating when you sit down with a group of children and they're like, yes, we are ready to talk about this.

We've been waiting to talk about this. And, um, you've given like, you've given them permission [00:28:00] to like have these questions and ask, instead of making their own judgments and assumptions based on students challenges that they see in their peers, they're, you're doing some guided learning with them in this area.

And that was where I felt comfortable really diving into this work and. It was really exciting to see, to hear what students had to say, they were all really positive about the topics and being able to engage in the discussion about, about neurodiversity when we started that. And then that helps me build confidence in really moving into other areas as well and having these open discussions.

Sarah Hahesy: Yeah. And you just made me think about another thing that kids really like is about fairness. And that's another way that you can jump into this is talking about, you know, I always start difficult conversations with, when I was a kid, we never talked about this. You were so fortunate that we can talk about race or that we can talk about ableism or whatever the [00:29:00] concept is.

So I name it for them and then I tell them, you know, how far, you know, They are, whereas, whereas I was not as far at their age, and, um, they kind of love that. And they also are just, I mean, I work with third graders, so they're very into fairness and equity on their own. Anyways, they want everyone to be treated well.

And, um, so just knowing where your kids are and thinking about stories that could really bring out like, you know, their character traits, like, you know, Kids want to see the right thing done. They want to learn about other people and just, you know, finding ways to just have those interactions happening in your classrooms or your spaces.

It's Really, really powerful.

I have a 

Amy Wonkka: question for both of you, maybe a little more for Sarah, because it's about, do you find the social justice work you're doing slides into other areas of your curriculum? Like, do you find that because of the work you guys are doing in this area, you're [00:30:00] having a deeper look at your science and social studies or your ELA?

Um, and if so, what, what are some of those things that you've noticed? 

Kate Grandbois: Yeah. 

Sarah Hahesy: So I mean, I've talked a lot about the beginning of the year because that's kind of where I'm gearing up for. But, um, not only did I get like social justice training when I first started, but I also was trained in responsive classroom, which talks a lot about, um, you know, the guiding principle.

The first guiding principle is that teaching social and emotional skills is as important as teaching academic content and, um, So that being said, you know, setting up your year where you teach everyone. I mean, this goes to like, um, equity and a big sense being like in my classroom. This is how we stack chairs in my classroom.

This is how we walk in the hallways and showing them this and actually I don't know how it's going to work out. I'll, I'll let you know but we kind of did this whole school wide project with our seventh grade buddies, [00:31:00] and where we made videos. About like how to walk in the hallway and how to do all these things because it was like kind of a challenge and you know the kids felt so empowered to do it.

Um, but also I hope that it's like a thing that everyone's like, Oh yeah I saw that in that video and we're supposed to do this and so just, you know, they know what it's supposed to look like sound like feel like. So that's one part of like responsive classroom. We also have morning meeting. Where we're greeting each other and we're sitting in a circle and I really like push it every day.

I'm like, you have to sit in a circle. You have to talk to each other. You have to say good morning. You have to greet them, you know, like by looking at them, if that's comfortable for you, but like, you know, just really acknowledging the people in your classroom. And, you know, we do a whole bunch of like fun getting to know you activities.

And there's so much that you can do with that. And then this social justice work you can really put it into everything so you can have it, and [00:32:00] you're reading you can choose your read alouds and what you want to convey like what messages do you want to put in there. And I said this before but talking about windows and mirrors and really having them think about.

You know, Oh, am I like this character? Am I different from this character? And it's kind of nice with a book because it's not a real person. So it's like, it's doing the work and practicing it in a way that might not be as like nerve wracking for students. Um, and a book that I use now is, um, on the day you begin by Jacqueline Woodson.

That's a great book to start the school year with. Um, it shows a lot of different perspectives and it starts so many of our conversations off, um, You know, on the way that I want them to go for the school year, I used to use first day jitters, which is also an awesome book, but, um, that didn't always set the tone in the way that I wanted it to go.

So reading you can really push that and, um, from there [00:33:00] like our district is also looking into diversifying our books and having different characters and all like representations of all that sort. But if your district isn't doing that. There's so many people you can follow on Instagram. You can find all sorts of book lists.

That you could focus this work on to, um, we also, um, this goes into our social studies units because we talk about the Wampanoag. We always start the year talking about Indigenous Peoples Day, and our district changed it from Columbus Day and so it's always a nice conversation to have about like why would we change that and know this is what you should know about Columbus, and, um, And then when we talk about the Wampanoag, um, I've really, um, worked on this for a few years, but just thinking about, you know, they're still here and telling the stories of resiliency and how they overcame that, like, massive oppression that they faced then [00:34:00] and now, and just, um, You know, talking about their relationship with the pilgrims and why they needed each other and how like that worked.

Um, and I think if you focus on resiliency versus like, I mean, you have to talk about the sad and horrible things too, but you have to show how people overcame this and kind of focus on that. Um, and then the final place that we do a lot of this work is in writing. We have a persuasive writing unit, and, you know, I always.

so much. Use mini lesson examples that are like things that I would want to see changed in the world, you know, like gender neutral toy aisles, um, making. I haven't used this yet, but I'm going to this year. But like, um, you know, storefronts in Massachusetts are impossible to get into. They're so inaccessible.

And I broke my ankle a few years ago and I also had kids and I like pushing a stroller into [00:35:00] some of these places. It's impossible. And we really should make it accessible for everyone. And, you know, I, I just choose things that I've seen and that are really important to me, and then they do the same. And so, you know, just thinking about their advocacy skills and how to, um, bring about the world that they want to see and that they have the power to do that.

And so you can kind of do it through everything. I guess I didn't bring up science, but. You know,

Kate Grandbois: and how does this, how do these components of curriculum end up shaping your work in speech pathology, Lauren? 

Lauren Tavares: Um, I spend, I spend a lot of time pushing into classrooms. So some of it is supporting this work as like we are working with students, either in the classroom or pulling them out and working on know those comprehension skills and reading and those writing and writing skills, things like that language organization, we can work in those areas that Sarah was talking and using those texts and, um, and [00:36:00] thinking really Yeah.

Being really thoughtful about an intentional about our choices in what material to use what books to use what to base our work on. And also, Sarah mentioned responsive classroom, that is so much of the social skills that we are working on. We are working on building connection between peers and perspective, their perspective taking of each other.

Those greetings in the morning are hard for a lot of my students. And so that's a way that I can come in and support this work and think about how they're going to navigate the social pragmatics of engaging with others, especially in these classrooms that are built around these principles.

Kate Grandbois: This has all been really, really helpful and informational, especially thinking about how this relates to the infrastructures that we work in, the communities that we're involved in, even just thinking about school as a community, instead of a place where you drop your kids off every day, [00:37:00] which, you know, is a really important distinction.

This is a classroom that they're spending. So many hours in through the course of the year. Um, I wonder if I know that I know that you're coming back for a part two, where you're going to unpack in a little bit more detail, what this curriculum actually looks like in practice before we close, do you have any final words of advice or suggestions for our listeners?

Lauren Tavares: I mean, we definitely want to acknowledge that this is hard work. It's a, it's a lot of work as teachers to implement this, um, these skills, and it's a lot of learning to do, and it can be scary at first. Um, and Sarah and I, we had some stumbles, and then we, we've had a lot of successes, but it doesn't all happen at once.

Um, and so it's really in finding your people, finding your support, building your confidence, and starting small. Start with where you feel comfortable, start with one strategy, [00:38:00] and find what, what's important to you to 

Sarah Hahesy: begin.

and the final thing that, um, has really helped me in this work, I mean, everything that you said, Lauren, I a thousand times agree with, but, um, Just thinking about how, when you do this work, it benefits all of us. It benefits everyone. And that is why it is so important that you try to do this.

Um, it makes a huge difference and, um, it's just, it's also really like, it just makes you feel great when, when you do it right. And when you don't, it's great to have those people to check in with and be like, Oh yeah, I should have said it this way. And to go with that. You can always go back like the conversation.

If you have a conversation that you don't think went well, you can always go back to your class and be like, you know, I didn't really like how he said this. Can I try again. And, you know, just kind of bringing up that, like you can try to fix this and do [00:39:00] this work, because it really is essential.

Thank 

Kate Grandbois: you so much to you both for sharing all of this with us today. We're really, really excited for a part two. Um, we already both have so many questions that we're really excited to ask you, but we will hold our tongues for the next time that you come onto the show. Thank you again so much for being 

Sarah Hahesy: here.

Thank you for having us. This was great. Thank you so much.

Sponsor 2

Announcer: Thank you again to our corporate sponsor, Feeding Matters. The entirely virtual Pediatric Feeding Disorder Conference is a great place to advance your skills with speakers from around the world. Earn over 20 CEUs of research focused and evidence based education. Learn more at feedingmatters. org slash conference. 

Outro

Kate Grandbois: Thank you so much for joining us in today's episode, as always, you can use this episode for ASHA CEUs. You can also potentially use this episode for other credits, depending on the regulations of your governing body. To determine if this episode will count towards [00:40:00] professional development in your area of study.

Please check in with your governing bodies or you can go to our website, www.slpnerdcast.com all of the references and information listed throughout the course of the episode will be listed in the show notes. And as always, if you have any questions, please email us at info@slpnerdcast.com

thank you so much for joining us and we hope to welcome you back here again soon.

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